Discussion:
[clisp-list] clisp max heap size on 64 bit machines
Don Cohen
2017-03-10 14:58:10 UTC
Permalink
Where can I find information about this?
I'm guessing it depends on the memory model, but also
perhaps on OS specific limits? I'm now imagining that
I can get as much physical memory as I need.
Jean Louis
2017-03-10 15:01:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Cohen
Where can I find information about this?
I'm guessing it depends on the memory model, but also
perhaps on OS specific limits? I'm now imagining that
I can get as much physical memory as I need.
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Not related to the CLISP question, I am somewhat surprised that
excellent piece of software such as GNU CLISP, is hosted on
Sourceforge, with this direct advertising to proprietary software.

I just wish and could help to make transition and clean the web pages,
and provide more information on CLISP and Lisp in general, and if
possible to transfer the development to GNU servers with their mailing
list. I am sure the FSF would help on such.

Sourceforge is much misleading, it is bringing people to iPhone and
other proprietary software and hardware through its advertising.

Jean Louis
J***@t-systems.com
2017-03-10 15:48:51 UTC
Permalink
Hi,
Sourceforge is much misleading, it is bringing people to iPhone and other proprietary
software and hardware through its advertising.
When I went to the European Lisp meetings, I was surprised that many many devs were using Lisp on Macbooks, running MacOS X. I seriously doubt Sourceforge led them there. There must be other reasons.
Not related to the CLISP question, I am somewhat surprised that excellent piece of software
such as GNU CLISP, is hosted on Sourceforge, with this direct advertising to proprietary software.
I seem to recall that last time this topic came up, I'll summarize and add my $0.01 as follows:

1. SF has reliably served CLISP for more years than some users' age.
1a. including a compile farm (is that still online?)
1b. Including binary downloads, not simply 200kB of webpages.

2. Regarding 2015 SF mishappenings (use stronger words as you wish), I believe they (fools!)
learned their lesson. Given that, what we can do is forgive them, not forget them.
In a democracy, one needs to maintain contact & discussion paths to people, not cut paths off. Especially in the long term.
Of course, everybody is free to ignore as many idiots in one's neighborhood as one wishes.
A little of this is necessary to try and remain sane.

BTW, I seem to recall some Lisp conference members asking to disable ad blockers such that they get a little revenue from their web pages. So I felt guilty, because I'm using my hand-written ad-blocker.

Regards,
Jörg Höhle
Pascal Bourguignon
2017-03-10 16:33:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by J***@t-systems.com
Hi,
Sourceforge is much misleading, it is bringing people to iPhone and other proprietary
software and hardware through its advertising.
When I went to the European Lisp meetings, I was surprised that many many devs were using Lisp on Macbooks, running MacOS X. I seriously doubt Sourceforge led them there. There must be other reasons.
Not related to the CLISP question, I am somewhat surprised that excellent piece of software
such as GNU CLISP, is hosted on Sourceforge, with this direct advertising to proprietary software.
1. SF has reliably served CLISP for more years than some users' age.
1a. including a compile farm (is that still online?)
1b. Including binary downloads, not simply 200kB of webpages.
2. Regarding 2015 SF mishappenings (use stronger words as you wish), I believe they (fools!)
learned their lesson. Given that, what we can do is forgive them, not forget them.
In a democracy, one needs to maintain contact & discussion paths to people, not cut paths off. Especially in the long term.
Of course, everybody is free to ignore as many idiots in one's neighborhood as one wishes.
A little of this is necessary to try and remain sane.
BTW, I seem to recall some Lisp conference members asking to disable ad blockers such that they get a little revenue from their web pages. So I felt guilty, because I'm using my hand-written ad-blocker.
Furthermore, it’s not entirely obvious what other service to use.

For example, there’s some recent discussion about github which seems to have some restriction on the licensing of what can be pushed onto it (as free software), that would actually make it impossible for GPL and MIT/BSD software.
--
__Pascal J. Bourguignon__
Jean Louis
2017-03-10 19:57:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Pascal Bourguignon
Furthermore, it’s not entirely obvious what other service to use.
For example, there’s some recent discussion about github which seems to have some restriction on the licensing of what can be pushed onto it (as free software), that would actually make it impossible for GPL and MIT/BSD software.
--
__Pascal J. Bourguignon__
I am sure that FSF has resources to host and provide what is
necesary. The GNU Mailing lists
https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/ are very well managed by
mailman, there are archives in mbox format available at all times, it
is really working smoothly.

Leaving the sourceforge mailing list, and creating new one there would
increase the reach to the people. I mean, Sourceforge search of the
mailing archive is not comparable to mailman on GNU and mboxes, that
may be downloaded.

I am willing to help in any matters that I can do, if this GNU
software may get its place under GNU websites.

Jean
Jean Louis
2017-03-10 19:54:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by J***@t-systems.com
Hi,
Sourceforge is much misleading, it is bringing people to iPhone and other proprietary
software and hardware through its advertising.
When I went to the European Lisp meetings, I was surprised that many
many devs were using Lisp on Macbooks, running MacOS X. I seriously
doubt Sourceforge led them there. There must be other reasons.
I understand it, as Lisp users are Lisp users, they are not
necessarily GNU users, neither free software users.

As CLISP being a GNU package, could have more freedom oriented
hosting.

Anyway, I am willing to help at list to maintain and improve the
website, in terms of links and other small matters or big matters.

And being the GNU software, I would include at list something like
:license, or (license) and inform users in that initial Welcoming
screen about licensing. As now copyrights are there nicely displayed,
yet, to get the licensing, one need to do the --license argument.

It would be better to say on first screen, something like:

Copyright by xxxxxx people

GNU CLISP is free software; you can redistribute and/or modify it
under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by
the Free Software Foundation; either version 2, or (at your option)
any later version. Enter (license) to see full information.


Jean
Sam Steingold
2017-03-10 17:22:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jean Louis
Not related to the CLISP question, I am somewhat surprised that
excellent piece of software such as GNU CLISP, is hosted on
Sourceforge, with this direct advertising to proprietary software.
Small price to pay for the service they have provided us for 15+ years.
Post by Jean Louis
I just wish and could help to make transition and clean the web pages,
and provide more information on CLISP and Lisp in general, and if
possible to transfer the development to GNU servers with their mailing
list. I am sure the FSF would help on such.
Savannah bug tracker sucks.
(specifically, the bug ids are universal rather than per-project).
However, I am willing to switch as long as someone else does all the
work, specifically,
* transition of bug/patch/rfe database
* transition of mercurial to git
* transition of mailing list archives
* updating all docs linking to SF db & ml.

PS. You email looks bogus. It really your personal valid email address?
--
Sam Steingold (http://sds.podval.org/) on darwin Ns 10.3.1504
http://steingoldpsychology.com http://www.childpsy.net http://jij.org
http://www.dhimmitude.org http://www.memritv.org http://islamexposedonline.com
Don't grow up! It's a trap!
Jean Louis
2017-03-10 20:07:05 UTC
Permalink
Hello Sam,
If you refer to that email above, I did not change it, that maybe
automatic protection of email address, I was thinking you are the one
having some Lisp software that is rot13 the email address to be
protected in public, from spam.

My domain is gnu.support, and email address in the header should
appear just fine.
Post by Sam Steingold
Post by Jean Louis
Not related to the CLISP question, I am somewhat surprised that
excellent piece of software such as GNU CLISP, is hosted on
Sourceforge, with this direct advertising to proprietary software.
Small price to pay for the service they have provided us for 15+ years.
Does freedom have price?

GNU software should promote the 4 freedoms and GPL licensing, and it
shall avoid the promotion of proprietary software. By the way, that is
more in accordance to GNU maintainer guidelines here:
https://www.gnu.org/prep/maintain/maintain.html

I know, I am picky. :-)
Post by Sam Steingold
Post by Jean Louis
I just wish and could help to make transition and clean the web pages,
and provide more information on CLISP and Lisp in general, and if
possible to transfer the development to GNU servers with their mailing
list. I am sure the FSF would help on such.
Savannah bug tracker sucks.
(specifically, the bug ids are universal rather than per-project).
However, I am willing to switch as long as someone else does all the
work, specifically,
* transition of bug/patch/rfe database
* transition of mercurial to git
* transition of mailing list archives
* updating all docs linking to SF db & ml.
I am very interested to do what is necessary, if it is to be
transitioned to GNU servers.

For transition of mercurial to git, this software may be of help:
http://repo.or.cz/fast-export.git

Jean Louis

Sam Steingold
2017-03-10 17:32:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Cohen
Where can I find information about this?
I think you can use 48 bits for addresses on 64 bit platforms.
Thus 2^48 bytes = 256TB.

IMO it should be explicitly specified at
http://clisp.org/impnotes/memory-models.html
(What I mean is "normative 'should'", i.e., I know it does not have that
information. Bruno, could you please fix that by editing
https://sourceforge.net/p/clisp/clisp/ci/tip/tree/doc/impbyte.xml?)
--
Sam Steingold (http://sds.podval.org/) on darwin Ns 10.3.1504
http://steingoldpsychology.com http://www.childpsy.net http://think-israel.org
https://ffii.org http://www.dhimmitude.org http://memri.org http://camera.org
Lisp: its not just for geniuses anymore.
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